Up Owners Club banner

1 - 9 of 9 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I know that something similar has been posted before but I don't think there's been a definitive answer yet: what exactly is the difference between the two engines? I've looked at all the tech specs and they look identical in terms of hardware. Am I right to conclude, therefore, that the differences lay in the ECU map?

If so, the ECU that's used (Bosch MED 17, I understand) has been 'hacked' before by tuners and I'd therefore think that a tune to get the 60bhp Up to 75bhp is a possibility in the near future. Am I being optimistic in my line of thinking here?

Alan
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
727 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
119 Posts
must be more than ecu as this dutch company upgrades the 60 to 72 and the 75 to 86 surely if it was just the ecu they could take the 60bhp and map straight to 86bhp or we could fit a 75bhp ecu straight on the 60bhp
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,382 Posts
up'sadaisy said:
must be more than ecu as this dutch company upgrades the 60 to 72 and the 75 to 86 surely if it was just the ecu they could take the 60bhp and map straight to 86bhp or we could fit a 75bhp ecu straight on the 60bhp
If I understand the web site, they also give you a 10% improvement in fuel economy which is surprising. Surely if you increase power, you burn more fuel, not that I know about tuning.

And would it not void the VW warranty?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
Not sure about the up! as i have not had mine yet to look at but vw now fit anti-tamper bolts to there ecu's across the rangeand you have to take the ecu out to flash the chip.
This means vw will know the car has been tampered with and any warrenty in regards to engine/transmission will be void.

Audi even have a system when they plug the diagnostics in for updates when the car comes in for sevice it also checks for unauthorised software changesthat a 3rd party has made and logs it at Audi gmbh !



I think if you want a 75hp buy a 75hp, i test drove the 60hp and although i thought it went fine i ordered the 75hp as i thought you can never have too much power.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Um. I'm not sure I agree with the need to take the ECU apart. Most cars can be reflashed via the OBD plug. That was true of my S class Merc and for Saabs I've owned. Moreover, the Dutch website I pasted a link to suggests that this is how it is done on the Up. Some (a very few) ECUs do need to be removed and flashed with a BDM but the Bosch system the Up has is the same chip as those that do not require this.

As for why I don't want to order a 75bhp Up, it's because it costs another £1500 more. I'm not interested in the extras the 75bhp Up has and so £1.5k for 15 bhp doesn't seem reasonable to me.

As to voiding the warranty, that's true. The Dutch remappers offer engine insurance, however. Can the map be detected? Not sure about VWs but the diagnostic system used by the dealers for Saabs (TECHII) is not able to and the same applies to that used on Mercs (DAS/Xentry). I know this because I own both diagnostic systems.

Finally, as suspected, this article confirms that the only differences between the two engines is in the software: http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/C71B1199DC1FAFDDCA257933000BADF2

Cheers.

Alan
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Correction. The 75 bhp model is £2,400 more than the base model. That's well into Polo territory
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
The majority of cars on the road are indeed obd2 but most new wave models of vags have to have the ecu removed and flashed as previously mentioned.
The facelift 2010 on vw t5 is a particular nightmare due to the position of the ecu which has to be removed, the pre 2010 models are a breeze taking about 30 mins through the obd2 port.

A lot of other brands are going this way for example here is a 2011 nissan navara we did last week-





The older models used obd2 like everything else, we have had to spend an additional £2000 on the jig equipment for these latest models and only the dealers havereplacement tamper bolts.



We advise the customer that the manufactuers warranty will be void, howeverthe tuning company we use for the maps do offer a warranty scheme for vehicles with up to 90,000 miles, and with vag models the new software will be traceable.



I am unsure of the up as we have not had one in yet but i do not see why itwould be any different to the new platforms above it.

If you look at the majority of ecu tuners you will se a vast difference in pricing when comparing new models to older models and this is because it is no longer a simple plug in process.



I have several vehicles here belonging to usthat we have mapped through obd2 and even alittle dragcarwith aftermarket autronic management that is far more complicated than any "chip" tuningbut the 2011 scirroco and 2012 vw T5 i have left alone as i do not relish the thought of explaining to the dealer why there are standard fastners fixing the ecu in place.



If you are after bang for your buck I could supply youa won nitrous kit that would give you an extra 25-150 bhp for £600 and as long as you fitted a new hp fuel line and intake hose before you took it in to vw nobodywould be any wiser !
 
1 - 9 of 9 Posts
Top