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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
It seems counter-intuitive to me that the more powerful engine has LOWER gearing. If I was cynical, i'd guess it was done to give the 75PS car faster acceleration figures on paper because there is no real-world difference between the two engines. Does anyone have a less cynical explanation?
 

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According to my Internet research on paper the 60ps is 1.1 second faster at 0 to 60 miles per hour. Check out zeroto60times.com but other sites disagree. Edited by: Beevee
 

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Needless to say, VW has the 60 PS slower 0""“62 mph.<mytubeelement =""bundle":"label_delimitor":":","percentage":"%","smart_buffer":"Smart Buffer","start_playing_when_buffered":"Start playing when buffered","":"","desktop_notification":"Desktop Notification","continuation_on_next_line":"-","loop":"Loop","only_notify":"Only Notify","estimated_time":"Estimated Time","global_preferences":"Global Preferences","no_notification_suped_on_your_browser":"No notification style suped on your browser version","video_buffered":"Video Buffered","buffered":"Buffered","hyphen":"-","buffered_message":"The video has been buffered as requested and is ready to play.","not_suped":"Not Suped","on":"On","off":"Off","click_to_enable_for__site":"Click to enable for site","desktop_notification_denied":"You have denied permission for desktop notification for site","notification_status_delimitor":";","error":"Error","adblock_interferance_message":"Adblock or similar extension is known to interfere with SmartVideo. Please add to adblock whitelist.","calculating":"Calculating","waiting":"Waiting","will_start_buffering_when_initialized":"Will start buffering when initialized","will_start_playing_when_initialized":"Will start playing when initialized","completed":"Completed","buffering_stalled":"Buffering is stalled. Will stop.","stopped":"Stopped","hr":"Hr","min":"Min","sec":"Sec","any_moment":"Any Moment","popup_donate_to":"Donate to","extension_id":null,"prefs":"desktopNotification":true,"Notification":true,"logLevel":0,"enable":true,"loop":false,"hidePopup":true,"autoPlay":false,"autoBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBufferPercentage":42,"autoPlayOnSmartBuffer":true,"quality":"large","fshd":false,"onlyNotification":true,"enableFullScreen":true,"saveBandwidth":true,"hideAnnotations":false,"turnOffPagedBuffering":true" ="preferencesUpdated" id="myTubeRelayElementToPage"></mytubeelement><mytubeelement =""loadBundle":true" ="relayPrefs" id="myTubeRelayElementToTab"></mytubeelement>
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
+2/3 e said:
Needless to say, VW has the 60 PS slower 0""“62 mph.
Just checked the VW up brochure and the 0-62 for the 60PS (manual) is stated as 14.4 seconds and for the 75PS it is stated as 13.2 seconds.Edited by: AlanG
 

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The site states that it gets its figures from a variety of sources.

Any 0-60 time in a manual car will depend largely on the "ability" of the driver.
 

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I've just had a 60ps take up on loan whilst my 75ps rock up has been in for clutch noise, I have to say, I thought the 60ps felt quicker to accelerate than mine, which could be down to the smaller wheels or the fact that if you look at the owners manual it states the 44kw develops its max torque at lower rpm???
 

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What is the gearing in top gear.Are they the same MPH per 1000 RPM?
You can try it by driving at 2000 RPM in 5th gear and seeing what the MPH is.

Alsodoes the ASG Automatic have different gearing MPH per 1000RPM?
 

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SMART EXAMINER said:
What is the gearing in top gear.
This site says that according to VW it's 0.796:1 in both cases. And that the diff ratio is 3.895:1 for the 60, 4.167:1 for the 75. All up!s seem to come with nearly identical tyre rolling circumferences.
SMART EXAMINER said:
Are they the same MPH per 1000 RPM?
So the 75's mph per 1000 rpm should be 7% slower than the 60's.
SMART EXAMINER said:
You can try it by driving at 2000 RPM in 5th gear and seeing what the MPH is.
Good idea ""“ it would be interesting to see some real figures! Best to give satnav speeds (on straight stretches of road), as speedo errors are typically about the same size as the difference we're looking for.<mytubeelement =""bundle":"label_delimitor":":","percentage":"%","smart_buffer":"Smart Buffer","start_playing_when_buffered":"Start playing when buffered","":"","desktop_notification":"Desktop Notification","continuation_on_next_line":"-","loop":"Loop","only_notify":"Only Notify","estimated_time":"Estimated Time","global_preferences":"Global Preferences","no_notification_suped_on_your_browser":"No notification style suped on your browser version","video_buffered":"Video Buffered","buffered":"Buffered","hyphen":"-","buffered_message":"The video has been buffered as requested and is ready to play.","not_suped":"Not Suped","on":"On","off":"Off","click_to_enable_for__site":"Click to enable for site","desktop_notification_denied":"You have denied permission for desktop notification for site","notification_status_delimitor":";","error":"Error","adblock_interferance_message":"Adblock or similar extension is known to interfere with SmartVideo. Please add to adblock whitelist.","calculating":"Calculating","waiting":"Waiting","will_start_buffering_when_initialized":"Will start buffering when initialized","will_start_playing_when_initialized":"Will start playing when initialized","completed":"Completed","buffering_stalled":"Buffering is stalled. Will stop.","stopped":"Stopped","hr":"Hr","min":"Min","sec":"Sec","any_moment":"Any Moment","popup_donate_to":"Donate to","extension_id":null,"prefs":"desktopNotification":true,"Notification":true,"logLevel":0,"enable":true,"loop":false,"hidePopup":true,"autoPlay":false,"autoBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBufferPercentage":42,"autoPlayOnSmartBuffer":true,"quality":"large","fshd":false,"onlyNotification":true,"enableFullScreen":true,"saveBandwidth":true,"hideAnnotations":false,"turnOffPagedBuffering":true" ="preferencesUpdated" id="myTubeRelayElementToPage"></mytubeelement><mytubeelement =""loadBundle":true" ="relayPrefs" id="myTubeRelayElementToTab"></mytubeelement>
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks for the link. It suggests that the 60PS engine is a better bet in having flatter power and torque curves with the benefit only switching to the 75PS above 5000rpm. I tend to max out at 4500rpm, so I'm never going to see the benefit when i swap my 60PS for a 75PS next month and in fact, in every day driving, it might feel worse!
 

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AlanG said:
It suggests that the 60PS engine is a better bet in having flatter power and torque curves
? No - it shows that they're identical""¦
AlanG said:
with the benefit only switching to the 75PS above 5000rpm.
""¦up to 4300 rpm.

(Annoyingly, the red & blue labels are the wrong way round on that plot, as you can see from the spreadsheet next to it (and from the knowledge that the higher-powered engine produces more power!).)<mytubeelement =""bundle":"label_delimitor":":","percentage":"%","smart_buffer":"Smart Buffer","start_playing_when_buffered":"Start playing when buffered","":"","desktop_notification":"Desktop Notification","continuation_on_next_line":"-","loop":"Loop","only_notify":"Only Notify","estimated_time":"Estimated Time","global_preferences":"Global Preferences","no_notification_suped_on_your_browser":"No notification style suped on your browser version","video_buffered":"Video Buffered","buffered":"Buffered","hyphen":"-","buffered_message":"The video has been buffered as requested and is ready to play.","not_suped":"Not Suped","on":"On","off":"Off","click_to_enable_for__site":"Click to enable for site","desktop_notification_denied":"You have denied permission for desktop notification for site","notification_status_delimitor":";","error":"Error","adblock_interferance_message":"Adblock or similar extension is known to interfere with SmartVideo. Please add to adblock whitelist.","calculating":"Calculating","waiting":"Waiting","will_start_buffering_when_initialized":"Will start buffering when initialized","will_start_playing_when_initialized":"Will start playing when initialized","completed":"Completed","buffering_stalled":"Buffering is stalled. Will stop.","stopped":"Stopped","hr":"Hr","min":"Min","sec":"Sec","any_moment":"Any Moment","popup_donate_to":"Donate to","extension_id":null,"prefs":"desktopNotification":true,"Notification":true,"logLevel":0,"enable":true,"loop":false,"hidePopup":true,"autoPlay":false,"autoBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBufferPercentage":42,"autoPlayOnSmartBuffer":true,"quality":"large","fshd":false,"onlyNotification":true,"enableFullScreen":true,"saveBandwidth":true,"hideAnnotations":false,"turnOffPagedBuffering":true" ="preferencesUpdated" id="myTubeRelayElementToPage"></mytubeelement><mytubeelement =""loadBundle":true" ="relayPrefs" id="myTubeRelayElementToTab"></mytubeelement>
 

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PS Ah, I think I see ""“ at first glance, you took the flattish line to be the 60 PS, and the diagonal one to be the 75, whereas they are actually torque and power, with the colours distinguishing the different engines (albeit the wrong way round).
<mytubeelement =""bundle":"label_delimitor":":","percentage":"%","smart_buffer":"Smart Buffer","start_playing_when_buffered":"Start playing when buffered","":"","desktop_notification":"Desktop Notification","continuation_on_next_line":"-","loop":"Loop","only_notify":"Only Notify","estimated_time":"Estimated Time","global_preferences":"Global Preferences","no_notification_suped_on_your_browser":"No notification style suped on your browser version","video_buffered":"Video Buffered","buffered":"Buffered","hyphen":"-","buffered_message":"The video has been buffered as requested and is ready to play.","not_suped":"Not Suped","on":"On","off":"Off","click_to_enable_for__site":"Click to enable for site","desktop_notification_denied":"You have denied permission for desktop notification for site","notification_status_delimitor":";","error":"Error","adblock_interferance_message":"Adblock or similar extension is known to interfere with SmartVideo. Please add to adblock whitelist.","calculating":"Calculating","waiting":"Waiting","will_start_buffering_when_initialized":"Will start buffering when initialized","will_start_playing_when_initialized":"Will start playing when initialized","completed":"Completed","buffering_stalled":"Buffering is stalled. Will stop.","stopped":"Stopped","hr":"Hr","min":"Min","sec":"Sec","any_moment":"Any Moment","popup_donate_to":"Donate to","extension_id":null,"prefs":"desktopNotification":true,"Notification":true,"logLevel":0,"enable":true,"loop":false,"hidePopup":true,"autoPlay":false,"autoBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBufferPercentage":42,"autoPlayOnSmartBuffer":true,"quality":"large","fshd":false,"onlyNotification":true,"enableFullScreen":true,"saveBandwidth":true,"hideAnnotations":false,"turnOffPagedBuffering":true" ="preferencesUpdated" id="myTubeRelayElementToPage"></mytubeelement><mytubeelement =""loadBundle":true" ="relayPrefs" id="myTubeRelayElementToTab"></mytubeelement>
 

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SMART EXAMINER said:
You can try it by driving at 2000 RPM in 5th gear and seeing what the MPH is.
In theory, the figures should be:

60 PS:
14" steelies: 42.5 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (14" + 2 × 70% × 165 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 3.895)
15" 'Waffle's: 42.4 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (15" + 2 × 55% × 185 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 3.895)

75 PS:
15" 'Spoke's: 39.6 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (15" + 2 × 55% × 185 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 4.167)
16" others: 40.1 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (16" + 2 × 50% × 185 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 4.167)

 

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(I got the 0.96 in the expressions above here.)<mytubeelement =""bundle":"label_delimitor":":","percentage":"%","smart_buffer":"Smart Buffer","start_playing_when_buffered":"Start playing when buffered","":"","desktop_notification":"Desktop Notification","continuation_on_next_line":"-","loop":"Loop","only_notify":"Only Notify","estimated_time":"Estimated Time","global_preferences":"Global Preferences","no_notification_suped_on_your_browser":"No notification style suped on your browser version","video_buffered":"Video Buffered","buffered":"Buffered","hyphen":"-","buffered_message":"The video has been buffered as requested and is ready to play.","not_suped":"Not Suped","on":"On","off":"Off","click_to_enable_for__site":"Click to enable for site","desktop_notification_denied":"You have denied permission for desktop notification for site","notification_status_delimitor":";","error":"Error","adblock_interferance_message":"Adblock or similar extension is known to interfere with SmartVideo. Please add to adblock whitelist.","calculating":"Calculating","waiting":"Waiting","will_start_buffering_when_initialized":"Will start buffering when initialized","will_start_playing_when_initialized":"Will start playing when initialized","completed":"Completed","buffering_stalled":"Buffering is stalled. Will stop.","stopped":"Stopped","hr":"Hr","min":"Min","sec":"Sec","any_moment":"Any Moment","popup_donate_to":"Donate to","extension_id":null,"prefs":"desktopNotification":true,"Notification":true,"logLevel":0,"enable":true,"loop":false,"hidePopup":true,"autoPlay":false,"autoBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBuffer":true,"autoPlayOnBufferPercentage":42,"autoPlayOnSmartBuffer":true,"quality":"large","fshd":false,"onlyNotification":true,"enableFullScreen":true,"saveBandwidth":true,"hideAnnotations":false,"turnOffPagedBuffering":true" ="preferencesUpdated" =""bundle":"label_delimitor":":","percentage":"%","smart_buffer":"smart="" buffer","start_playing_when_buffered":"start="" playing="" when="" buffered","":"","desktop_notification":"desktop="" notification","continuation_on_next_line":"-","loop":"loop","only_notify":"Only="" notify","estimated_time":"estimated="" time","global_preferences":"global="" preferences","no_notification_suped_on_your_browser":"no="" notification="" style="" suped="" on="" your="" browser="" version","video_buffered":"video="" buffered","buffered":"buffered","hyphen":"-","buffered_message":"the="" video="" has="" been="" buffered="" as="" requested="" and="" is="" ready="" to="" play.","not_suped":"not="" suped","on":"On","off":"off","click_to_enable_for__site":"click="" enable="" for="" site","desktop_notification_denied":"you="" have="" denied="" permission="" desktop="" site","notification_status_delimitor":";","error":"error","adblock_interferance_message":"adblock="" or="" similar="" extension="" known="" interfere="" with="" smartvideo.="" please="" add="" adblock="" whitelist.","calculating":"calculating","waiting":"waiting","will_start_buffering_when_initialized":"will="" start="" buffering="" initialized","will_start_playing_when_initialized":"will="" initialized","completed":"completed","buffering_stalled":"buffering="" stalled.="" will="" stop.","stopped":"stopped","hr":"hr","min":"min","sec":"sec","any_moment":"any="" moment","popup_donate_to":"donate="" to","extension_id":null,"prefs":"desktopnotification":true,"notification":true,"loglevel":0,"enable":true,"loop":false,"hidepopup":true,"autoplay":false,"autobuffer":true,"autoplayOnbuffer":true,"autoplayOnbufferpercentage":42,"autoplayOnsmartbuffer":true,"quality":"large","fshd":false,"onlynotification":true,"enablefullscreen":true,"savebandwidth":true,"hideannotations":false,"turnoffpagedbuffering":true"="preferencesUpdated" id="myTubeRelayElementToPage"></mytubeelement><mytubeelement =""loadBundle":true" ="relayPrefs" =""loadbundle":true"="relayPrefs" id="myTubeRelayElementToTab"></mytubeelement>
 

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+2/3 e said:
SMART EXAMINER said:
You can try it by driving at 2000 RPM in 5th gear and seeing what the MPH is.
In theory, the figures should be:

60 PS:
14" steelies: 42.5 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (14" + 2 × 70% × 165 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 3.895)
15" 'Waffle's: 42.4 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (15" + 2 × 55% × 185 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 3.895)

75 PS:
15" 'Spoke's: 39.6 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (15" + 2 × 55% × 185 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 4.167)
16" others: 40.1 mph = 2,000 rpm × (0.96 × (16" + 2 × 50% × 185 mm) × Ï) ÷ (0.796 × 4.167)


Thanks for that.

So thats roughly 21 MPH per 1000 RPM for the 60 PS
and 20 MPH per 1000 RPM for the 75 PS

Not very high geared really. My Smart is geared at 27 MPH per 1000 RPM,so around 2200 RPM at 60 MPH. Nice and relaxed on the motorway.
 

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That and being able to charge more for a more powerful version, despite that they only differ in ECU mapping and final drive ratio.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I suspect you're right. VW are in business to make money - not because they are deeply concerned about our motoring needs.Edited by: AlanG
 
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