New Competition in citycar market

proud_darcy · Aug 28, 2014

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review...lt-twingo-tce-90-dynamique-first-drive-review

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/renault/twingo/88372/renault-twingo-dynamique-tce-2014-review

General consensus amongst the reviewers is that it isn't quite as composed or refined as the triplets.

It is also quite expensive.

The big issue for me is that it doesn't handle as well out of town and steering needs constant correction at motorway speeds.

I was up to 15000 euro in the configurator before I got a well configured car. At the moment you can buy a Seat Mii i-tech in germany for a list price of 11200 with plenty of discount available and the i-tech special edition comes with sat-nav, alloys, nice interior trim and dash and climate control.

Whatever about comparing it to a Mii, the prices are as high as Fiestas and Corsas with "cool and sound" type packages.

It is just too expensive for the segment and now that we are seeing heavy discounting and special editions for the triplets the new twingo has its work cut out for itself.

Edited by: proud_darcy

Jstars · Aug 29, 2014

Yeah it is pricey plus they don't allow you to turn off the esp and drift it! What a way to ruin a rear drive rear engine car! As I won't lie I would've considered the Renault sport version when it comes out alongside the up gt...

proud_darcy · Sep 2, 2014

I had a test drive in a Twingo 70ps SCE with stop\start today.

I wasn't impressed.

It is so very noisy even allowing for the fabric roof. The engine noise just never goes away.

The gearshift is not great compared to the direct shift on a Ka, Panda, i10 or VW triplet.
You can't slice through roundabouts.
The holder for the smartphone is just plain silly and awkward to use.
There is more rear space in a VW triplet.
It isn't at all fast.
The interior materials are no better than in a VW triplet.
It isn't great at speed on the motorway and you have to slow down more than you expect to go around the corners on off-ramps
It just doesn't corner well. Steering is probably too light.

I have grave concerns about the front bonnet. It is secured by fabric straps and a key holder is in place to stop you removing it. The keylock looks like it can be forced open with a screwdriver or cordless drill.
I think there is a very real chance that these cars will fall victim to junkies who will steal the plastic bonnet and battery with no more than a screwdriver and a snips. They'll get 20 quid for each and leave the owner with a huge bill for repair.

VW Triplets and Ford Ka have large discounts and special editions coming through.
The Ka isn't refined but drives well and can be bought cheaply. The VW is refined costs a bit more and drives well for not much more.
The Twingo isn't refined, doesn't drive well and is expensive but it has some showroom appeal.

Also, I didn't drive a RHD car but based on the space in the footwell I just can't see how the pedals won't be off-set making the driving position a bit worse.

I forgot to mention that the interior rear view mirror is too small. It sounds like I'm nitpicking but it really is too small.
In my opinion having driven most of the cars in the class as hire cars or as demonstrators the VW triplets are still best of the bunch.

Edited by: proud_darcy

Cadfael · Sep 2, 2014

Germany is not known as the land of roundabouts ...

But I have one on my way to the company and have to agree that the up! behaves best!
Only other cars can stop me whizzing through it ...

Learnt roundabout driving/riding on my England holidays and still benefit by these experiences!

Privatedoc · Sep 3, 2014

HOWEVER when it arrives with a smart badge on it, they will sell loads in uk....designer cars!...Bah!

juan37 · Sep 3, 2014

It looks like a Fiat 500, and is less secure than the UP!:
http://www.euroncap.com/results/renault/twingo/563.aspx

Other review:
http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/Renault-twingo-first-drive-2014-08-28

Another detail, with the rear engine at low altitude, and the trunk above it, then where is the air intake?. What can happen on a flooded street, and enters water in the admission?

At security level in case of a frontal impact at high speed, the engine can be released by his own inertia, and impact the passengers from behind. This fault does not appear in the Euro NCAP tests, because they aren't made at high speed.

I don't like it.

Leif · Sep 4, 2014

juan37 said:
At security level in case of a frontal impact at high speed, the engine can be released by his own inertia, and impact the passengers from behind. This fault does not appear in the Euro NCAP tests, because they aren't made at high speed.

Apparently the engine slides under the rear passengers, not into them.

Not keen on the car, thus far the Up is the best small car IMO.

spcvw · Sep 4, 2014

French, enough said.

Privatedoc · Sep 4, 2014

OOhh La La ...I agree.......make great cheese/wine/fashion etc but cars....not now!

Edited by: Privatedoc

juan37 · Sep 4, 2014

Theoretically, can be right what You sai: "the engine slides under the rear passengers, not into them."

But really when the car brakes before impact and at impact moment, the car tail is much higher than the front, so the horizantal path of the engine wth gearbox impacting passengers at half.

Cadfael · Sep 9, 2014

New data from the "Kraftfahtrbundesamt" KBA (federal office for vehicles) in Germany ...

New registered small cars, August 2014 (in Germany) ...
1. Hyundai i10 (2156)
2. Fiat 500 (2145)
3. up! (1830)

Leif · Sep 9, 2014

How odd, the Fiat 500 has less room, less boot space, and by all accounts isn't as good to drive. And the base spec version costs more.

juan37 · Sep 9, 2014

Cadfael said:
New data from the "Kraftfahtrbundesamt" KBA (federal office for vehicles) in Germany ...

New registered small cars, August 2014 (in Germany) ...
1. Hyundai i10 (2156)
2. Fiat 500 (2145)
3. up! (1830)

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<div id="gt-res-" ="almost_half_cell"><div dir="ltr" style="zoom:1">How is the comparison of thei10 sold in Germany with UP!?

The version of the i10 that sells here, has litler space for passenger and driver, has littler wheels (13 inch), and the engine is 1.2 which consumes a lot more of fuel than the UP!
Now I see the version selled in europe, has a three-cylinder which produces 65bhp and 69lb ft - with a 14.9 second 0-62mph time and a top speed of 96mph.
What advantage has over the UP?
Only a cheaper price?

gazal1968 · Sep 9, 2014

Test driving the twingo on Friday,taking the new catus for a spin too as the garages area quite close.will report back on how it compares to the UP.

Cadfael · Sep 9, 2014

Hi Juan,

the number of cars includes all variations of this model.
The 1830 up!s aren't devided into take/move/high (as this is a federal statistic).

Same with the i10. Can't say if more well or poor equipped variations have been sold ...

proud_darcy · Sep 9, 2014

FIAT 500 isn't really in the same market. Stopped to talk to neighbour who was driving a new car last week. The car replaces her last car which was a fiat 500c with brown hood. The car she replaced it with is a 500c with a 105bhp twinair engine. That's a totally different market segment than the i10 or Up!

upmancotswolds · Sep 11, 2014

The reason my up isn't here yet is because I held off on the order until I've test driven the new twingo. And it certainly isn't a bad car, but for me there wasn't anything that made me feel like I wanted to pay the premium for one over an up. The touchscreen link system is miles better than the maps and more, but overall I didn't see it as a better car.

Leif · Sep 11, 2014

proud_darcy said:
FIAT 500 isn't really in the same market. Stopped to talk to neighbour who was driving a new car last week. The car replaces her last car which was a fiat 500c with brown hood. The car she replaced it with is a 500c with a 105bhp twinair engine. That's a totally different market segment than the i10 or Up!

I see the 500 as a cute little runaround. The Up is more practical with more space for carrying stuff, and more friendly for rear passengers. Shame as I like the looks of the 500. Oh, but it's a Fiat, so it'll fall apart after a few years ...

TurboTomato · Sep 11, 2014

juan37 said:
Cadfael said:

New data from the "Kraftfahtrbundesamt" KBA (federal office for vehicles) in Germany ...

New registered small cars, August 2014 (in Germany) ...
1. Hyundai i10 (2156)
2. Fiat 500 (2145)
3. up! (1830)

Click to expand...


<div id="gt--tools"><div id="gt--tools-l"><div style="display: inline-block;" id="gt--tool"><div id="itamenu">

<div id="gt-res-" ="almost_half_cell"=""><div dir="ltr" style="zoom:1">How is the comparison of thei10 sold in Germany with UP!?

The version of the i10 that sells here, has litler space for passenger and driver, has littler wheels (13 inch), and the engine is 1.2 which consumes a lot more of fuel than the UP!
Now I see the version selled in europe, has a three-cylinder which produces 65bhp and 69lb ft - with a 14.9 second 0-62mph time and a top speed of 96mph.
What advantage has over the UP?
Only a cheaper price?

Yeah the European model of the i10 is brand new and only just launched - have seen a few on the road and they look pretty nice but haven't have a chance to have a proper poke around inside one to see how they compare with the triple. However, in the UK at least, they have the advantage of Hyundai's 5 year warranty over the triples.

Bossphillip · Sep 13, 2014

Hi you say in your post 'poor equipped variations ' what difference does it make ?? Some people may not want or cannot afford to own a car of its incredible, fantastic, value for money vehicle. Also the 'poor equipped vehicle' as you say, it is most probably the best selling car in its range. Kind regards phill.Edited by: Bossphillip

New Competition in citycar market

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