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The ASG gearbox (rant)

26K views 8 replies 8 participants last post by  nadeem 
#1 ·
Hey everybody!


I should start off by saying I'm just here to give my honest opinion about the ASG gearbox and let you in on some of the problems I've been experiencing. The up has been around for 6 years, so maybe there's some kind of fix that I don't know of yet? I really hope to find some solutions here, or to listen to other forum member's problems or find out how they deal with it.


It might turn into a rant. If you don't like that or think the ASG was the best thing since sliced bread, this topic might not be for you. Not trying to start a discussion, just need this off my chest.
I should warn you this post might get veeeeeery long.


I haven't had any experience with many cars before this, and only drove an automatic car once (5.7 V8, 8 speed ZF).


---


My parents recently bought me a VW up!. It's my first car. I'm 18. It's a cute car, surprisingly roomy inside, an automatic and pretty well built (doesn't make any noise going down the road at all, whereas some cars would squeak or something plastic could rattle, ...) ""” I'd say it's a worthy VW product.


Except for the gearbox...
is that?! How did VW ever get away with putting a horrible gearbox like this in their cars? It literally feels like they spend like ‚¬5 on R&D and called it a day.
I just can't believe a world leading car company that came up with direct injected turbo- or twin charged engines mated to dual clutches in the most basic cars, comes up with a piece of crap like this.


The problem's I've been having:
<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">when getting moving from a stop, it stutters a little and jumps forward when the clutch is released. Then it's fine. I feel like it tries to release the clutch with as little throttle as possible, causing the stuttering.[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">you can do the laundry in between gear shifts, especially 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd. Sometimes, you can see the speedometer drop a little before it engages the next gear... I still drive manuals all the time (I've driven over 15k km in manuals last year when I need to drive for my parents (who can't drive themselves anymore because of disabilities) or family members), and my gear changes are faster and smoother (none of the passengers are thrown around the vehicle). You'd expect a computer to be better than a human, right?[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">it stay in the lower rev range for way too long. It does 50 km/h in 5th, which is probably economical and environmentally-friendly and everything, but it's lugging the engine and when there's just the slightest incline, it doesn't know what to do anymore... Even a turbo wouldn't be smooth at 1,1k rpm anymore, but a naturally aspirated 1 liter 3 cyl. When coming to a stop, it'll always try to stay in the slowest rev range, which doesn't make sense... For example, if you slowed down to 40 km/h (25mph), it's still in 5th (maybe with the clutch in? I don't know) and obviously it's not going to accelerate, it needs to downshift to 3rd first, while really it already should've been in 3rd. This must be a software thing, right? Uphill, it always tries to stay in a gear that's not appropriate, so it just downshifts in the least comfortable way possible.[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">sometimes, it just doesn't shift. This could happen uphill, after it's been driving slowly, or at roundabouts, and it's terrifying. You just press the accelerator, and nothing happens. It's like the engine is off. It's a combination of the up! cruising at way too low rpm's again (while slowing down), having to shift when you try to accelerate and the fact that it sometimes takes a ridiculously long time to engage the next gear. It could be like 3-ish seconds, but the worst time was when I was on a roundabout and I just rolled for almost half the roundabout (it was a very large one) without accelerating. I was pumping the pedal, praying to Jesus and it said it was in D2 but clearly the clutch was not engaging for like 5 to 6-ish seconds. Just rolling at 10 km/h. That's dangerous.[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">it clunks into reverse... but only like once every 5 times. It sounds and feels like it's destroying itself. There's a loud clunk inside and the entire car shakes. Pretty embarrassing when you're out with friends, and from the outside it sounds like an even louder, short, sharp grinding noise. I know it doesn't have synchro's, but so do most manuals, and I've never had this happen in a manual, except if you were still rolling forward a bit when engaging first (which the up! can't do, it always happens when it's came to a complete stop). Manoeuvring in reverse almost requires driving with two feet. I know that's not good for an automatic with (a) clutch(es), but it's just not very refined or precise.
[/list]
Side note: I also think the idle is set too low for a 3 cyl. It literally shakes like crazy in neutral, except if the AC is on. In Drive, it revs up a little, but in D with AC on, it's makes like 900 rpm and then it starts shaking even more than at idle.
So if it idles at 750 rpm, it vibrates, At like 800 rpm it's fine, and at 900 it vibrates even worse, but after 1k rpm, it's gone again.


I've learned to pump the gas quickly every time you want to accelerate, it forces the car to shift to 3rd from 5th, which is the only way you'll get it to accelerate.
At highway speeds, you have to kick down to force it from 5th to 3rd, and if you press just a little harder (there's like a rest for the gas pedal, but you can push it a little beyond that), it'll go to 2nd, which you'll need for overtaking or engine braking down a steep hill.
But at this point, there are just so many foot movements, it's not better than a manual.


But the worst part is: I've been in a friends Fiat 500, which has a single-clutch automatic, too. It's just much smoother!
And a few days ago, I was in another friend's (slightly older) Peugeot, also a single-clutch automatic. you could hear a clunk every now and then when it changed gears, but it was butter smooth compared to the up!! It just shifts pretty much instantly, like the up! should.


Now, don't get me wrong. I know this is a semi-automatic, and I shouldn't expect it to drive like a Jaguar. But I feel like the software is just not optimised for this gearbox/engine. I'm just shocked that a French or Italian car's technology is just miles better than Volkswagen's. It's just crap and next to these two, it's total garbage!
It's almost impossible to believe Volkswagen has been offering this gearbox for 6 years. I just can't. They must've updated it by now, right? Is there a software update or something like that? They can't just sell a product like this and sleep at night, knowing how rubbish it is, right? They just can't?
It's just downright embarrassing to have people with you in the car or to let someone drive it. It's kinda dangerous, actually.


If anyone made it this far: thank you. I really wanted to share this with someone.
If there's people out there with an ASG as well: how does yours behave? Any tips and tricks?
Did VW, after all these years, not come up with a software update or something?




Thank you!






Edited by: mikejkklt
 
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#3 ·
VW could have somehow dug up an old torque converter auto box.but as the UP!s gearbox is purpose designed to go with the engine, they probably just added a servo and controller to the normal manual box, for some god awful reason.
 
#4 ·
That's a good post Mike.

When I bought my first Up I tried a Manual and an automatic and I have to admit the automatic one drove OK although I must admit a test drive does not cover all road conditions.
I was tempted but having read the reviews decided on the manual but there are forum members with auto's who are happy with them.

Might be useful to have a section on the forum specifically for the auto's.

Edited by: Derkie54
 
#5 ·
whats up said:
Wow, that's a long rant and really small font.... The Up! is the only VW to have the ASG gearbox, all other models have the better and more expensive DSG box, so I guess it all down to cost.
I'm sorry, didn't want to sound ungrateful, I think it's a cute car, the steering is quite precise and extremely light and it's a fun car overall. I'm just so sad about the gearbox... it ruins everything imo.

I'm sorry about the font! Don't know what happened there... Had to edit it twice because the smileys and bullet points got messed up as well...


And honestly, I don't think it would've killed them to add a DSG to this car. The Polo was made (or is being made?) with the exact same engine mated to a DSG. I don't know if there's not enough room, or if they were scared it might be a reason to pick the up over a DSG? I would've been prepared to pay up to ‚¬1.000 extra (on top of the current price for an ASG) for a dual-clutch transmission, though!

bumbleMii said:
VW could have somehow dug up an old torque converter auto box.but as the UP!s gearbox is purpose designed to go with the engine, they probably just added a servo and controller to the normal manual box, for some god awful reason.
I understand VW is all about innovating and a torque converter might sound like 'old technology' to them. And I do understand that a torque converter slips when it's not locked up and will take away a few of your extremely precious horsepower (if you don't have many, you can't really afford to lose any) and kind of impossible in a world where city cars compete by their fuel economy number, but I think it would ride like a dream!

And a DSG would probably result in better fuel economy, because you pretty much don't loose any torque in between gearshifts. Can't really say that about the ASG :/ ...


Derkie54 said:
That's a good post Mike.
Thank you! I was kind of afraid some people might not appreciate it, but I'm afraid it's the cold, hard truth...

Derkie54 said:
I was tempted but having read the reviews decided on the manual but there are forum members with auto's who are happy with them.
I've read very bad reviews about Fiat's Dualogic as well, but honestly, it shifts like a dream compared to the up!, and it's the same technology... I really never expected brands that I considered 'under VW's level' to be lightyears ahead of VW. Even though French and Italian carmakers have been using single-clutch automatics for much longer, VW has offered them in some Lupo models (like the diesel 3L) and the Fox, if I'm not mistaken.

I understand some people think it's fine, and so does my dad, but then again, he drove it on a straight, flat road at 70 km/h so it just kept cruising in 5th @ 2k rpm which seems to be its happy place. It doesn't sound like it's lugging anymore, it's probably getting like 500 mpg and it doesn't need to shift. However, when entering our neighbourhood, the street goes uphill just a tinietiny bit. A normal car can just stay in whatever gear it was in, but the up immediately goes to 4th (sudden downshifts are the worst!), then decides to go back to 5th, doesn't really work (especially since it lost quite a bit of torque again because it took so long to shift), so back to 4th it goes until it tries 5th again... it literally does that like 5 times until it can finally handle it in 5th...

Right now I just keep on pumping the gas pedal so it stays in 3rd... Every few seconds it wants to upshift again, so you need to pump again... I just don't understand
 
#6 ·
Hey everybody!


I should start off by saying I'm just here to give my honest opinion about the ASG gearbox and let you in on some of the problems I've been experiencing. The up has been around for 6 years, so maybe there's some kind of fix that I don't know of yet? I really hope to find some solutions here, or to listen to other forum member's problems or find out how they deal with it.


It might turn into a rant. If you don't like that or think the ASG was the best thing since sliced bread, this topic might not be for you. Not trying to start a discussion, just need this off my chest.
I should warn you this post might get veeeeeery long.


I haven't had any experience with many cars before this, and only drove an automatic car once (5.7 V8, 8 speed ZF).


---


My parents recently bought me a VW up!. It's my first car. I'm 18. It's a cute car, surprisingly roomy inside, an automatic and pretty well built (doesn't make any noise going down the road at all, whereas some cars would squeak or something plastic could rattle, ...) ""” I'd say it's a worthy VW product.


Except for the gearbox...
is that?! How did VW ever get away with putting a horrible gearbox like this in their cars? It literally feels like they spend like ‚¬5 on R&D and called it a day.
I just can't believe a world leading car company that came up with direct injected turbo- or twin charged engines mated to dual clutches in the most basic cars, comes up with a piece of crap like this.


The problem's I've been having:
<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">when getting moving from a stop, it stutters a little and jumps forward when the clutch is released. Then it's fine. I feel like it tries to release the clutch with as little throttle as possible, causing the stuttering.
[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">you can do the laundry in between gear shifts, especially 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd. Sometimes, you can see the speedometer drop a little before it engages the next gear... I still drive manuals all the time (I've driven over 15k km in manuals last year when I need to drive for my parents (who can't drive themselves anymore because of disabilities) or family members), and my gear changes are faster and smoother (none of the passengers are thrown around the vehicle). You'd expect a computer to be better than a human, right?
[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">it stay in the lower rev range for way too long. It does 50 km/h in 5th, which is probably economical and environmentally-friendly and everything, but it's lugging the engine and when there's just the slightest incline, it doesn't know what to do anymore... Even a turbo wouldn't be smooth at 1,1k rpm anymore, but a naturally aspirated 1 liter 3 cyl. When coming to a stop, it'll always try to stay in the slowest rev range, which doesn't make sense... For example, if you slowed down to 40 km/h (25mph), it's still in 5th (maybe with the clutch in? I don't know) and obviously it's not going to accelerate, it needs to downshift to 3rd first, while really it already should've been in 3rd. This must be a software thing, right? Uphill, it always tries to stay in a gear that's not appropriate, so it just downshifts in the least comfortable way possible.
[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">sometimes, it just doesn't shift. This could happen uphill, after it's been driving slowly, or at roundabouts, and it's terrifying. You just press the accelerator, and nothing happens. It's like the engine is off. It's a combination of the up! cruising at way too low rpm's again (while slowing down), having to shift when you try to accelerate and the fact that it sometimes takes a ridiculously long time to engage the next gear. It could be like 3-ish seconds, but the worst time was when I was on a roundabout and I just rolled for almost half the roundabout (it was a very large one) without accelerating. I was pumping the pedal, praying to Jesus and it said it was in D2 but clearly the clutch was not engaging for like 5 to 6-ish seconds. Just rolling at 10 km/h. That's dangerous.
[/list]<ul style="list-style-: disc">
<li style="margin: 0px; font-stretch: normal; line-height: normal; font-family: "Helvetica Neue"; color: rgb69, 69, 69;">it clunks into reverse... but only like once every 5 times. It sounds and feels like it's destroying itself. There's a loud clunk inside and the entire car shakes. Pretty embarrassing when you're out with friends, and from the outside it sounds like an even louder, short, sharp grinding noise. I know it doesn't have synchro's, but so do most manuals, and I've never had this happen in a manual, except if you were still rolling forward a bit when engaging first (which the up! can't do, it always happens when it's came to a complete stop). Manoeuvring in reverse almost requires driving with two feet. I know that's not good for an automatic with (a) clutch(es), but it's just not very refined or precise.
[/list]
Side note: I also think the idle is set too low for a 3 cyl. It literally shakes like crazy in neutral, except if the AC is on. In Drive, it revs up a little, but in D with AC on, it's makes like 900 rpm and then it starts shaking even more than at idle.
So if it idles at 750 rpm, it vibrates, At like 800 rpm it's fine, and at 900 it vibrates even worse, but after 1k rpm, it's gone again.


I've learned to pump the gas quickly every time you want to accelerate, it forces the car to shift to 3rd from 5th, which is the only way you'll get it to accelerate.
At highway speeds, you have to kick down to force it from 5th to 3rd, and if you press just a little harder (there's like a rest for the gas pedal, but you can push it a little beyond that), it'll go to 2nd, which you'll need for overtaking or engine braking down a steep hill.
But at this point, there are just so many foot movements, it's not better than a manual.


But the worst part is: I've been in a friends Fiat 500, which has a single-clutch automatic, too. It's just much smoother!
And a few days ago, I was in another friend's (slightly older) Peugeot, also a single-clutch automatic. you could hear a clunk every now and then when it changed gears, but it was butter smooth compared to the up!! It just shifts pretty much instantly, like the up! should.


Now, don't get me wrong. I know this is a semi-automatic, and I shouldn't expect it to drive like a Jaguar. But I feel like the software is just not optimised for this gearbox/engine. I'm just shocked that a French or Italian car's technology is just miles better than Volkswagen's. It's just crap and next to these two, it's total garbage!
It's almost impossible to believe Volkswagen has been offering this gearbox for 6 years. I just can't. They must've updated it by now, right? Is there a software update or something like that? They can't just sell a product like this and sleep at night, knowing how rubbish it is, right? They just can't?
It's just downright embarrassing to have people with you in the car or to let someone drive it. It's kinda dangerous, actually.


If anyone made it this far: thank you. I really wanted to share this with someone.
If there's people out there with an ASG as well: how does yours behave? Any tips and tricks?
Did VW, after all these years, not come up with a software update or something?




Thank you!






Edited by: mikejkklt
I’ve had an ASG UP! since 2013 and it’s a very dim witted gearbox the best way to drive is in manual by pushing the lever all the way over to the left. This way you can control the up shifts by pushing the lever forward. I have found in normal driving it’s best to let it shift down on it’s own otherwise it shifts same time as you do and drops to gears. By changing gear manually and lift and crusing(dropping into neutral when coming up to lights, stationary traffic or small declines)has improved mpg by at least 20%
 
#7 ·
We have a VW up and it’s a lovely little car for the wife but the gear box is a night mare when she gets in the car in the garage it will not go into reverse and she needs to inch forward then try reverse again, this can result in her touching the wall before reverse can be achieved. It’s getting worse and normal mechanics don’t want to know, so it might end up at the VW garage, I see a big bill coming. Ps the car is a 1913 plate .
 
#9 ·
I have a Seat Mii with the semi-auto gearbox. This is basically the same car as a VW Up. The problem I have is that the digital gear display on the dash does not change between D mode and M mode.
It displays D1, D2, D3 etc.., in D mode and when in M mode it shows D followed by whatever the last gear was. Quite simply I have no way of knowing which gear I am in when in M mode.

Otherwise the car drives fine. Is this is a software glitch and what the fix be. any suggestions.Thanks.
 
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